Symmetrical AWD

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Hi Guys,

Just a quick one to rest my curiosity.  My RX wagon has "symmetrical" above the AWD badge on the boot.  I havent seen this on any other libertys.  Is this just a MY03 thing??  I assume that all the Gen3s share the same driveline so why the late addition of the symmetrical badge or do everyone elses just fall off. 

Sorry if this is a really stupid question, haha.

Cheers!

shnad
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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They started to badge these from 03 onwards.

Just another sale pitch to snag clients big_smile

Kosti
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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^What he said.


But is it ACTUALLY symmetrical front-to-rear? Isn't it more biased one way than the other?

Shiv
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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Bilsteined wrote:

^What he said.
But is it ACTUALLY symmetrical front-to-rear? Isn't it more biased one way than the other?
Afaik the manuals are symetrical. I've heard it said that the autos are 90/10, but can change up to 50/50 when required.

XoN
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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XoN wrote:

Afaik the manuals are symetrical. I've heard it said that the autos are 90/10, but can change up to 50/50 when required.
90/10?!! That much! Had no idea...

Shiv
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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i read on the cars guide or car point ( something like those sites ) that it's 95/5

weezer
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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if your cruising down a high way, it is 90/10, when you give it a boot full 50/50.

Soop
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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I know someone who installed a large turbo to an automatic Forester and because of the torque split he kept bagging up the fronts and sold the turbo because it was undrivable. So I don't think the really get 50/50 split happening.

fatcat67
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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maybe it was rooted?  i drive my car on dirt roads and it spins the rears more than the front.

Soop
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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Nah, it isn't rooted. It was a very new XT. This isn't the first example of this that I've heard of. The turbo was an APS SR50, so fairly large.

fatcat67
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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Yeah i think it's 90/10 front to rear in the 4 auto models.
Lol, didn't feel that way in my Gen 3 RX though, always booted the rear out when cornering hard with full power.

Gen 4 5 speed autos are different though, they are 45/55 front to rear by default and then move the power split as for traction.

GTAndy
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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GTAndy wrote:

Yeah i think it's 90/10 front to rear in the 4 auto models.
Lol, didn't feel that way in my Gen 3 RX though, always booted the rear out when cornering hard with full power.
Gen 4 5 speed autos are different though, they are 45/55 front to rear by default and then move the power split as for traction.
As above, when needed the autos can adjust to up to 50/50, which is why you were still able to get the rear out...

XoN
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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I don't think it's 50/50 is more 45/55 big_smile

Standard slow speed driving or cruising will see a 45:55 (front/rear) ratio. However, the system can transfer more torque to the front wheels when the rear wheels start to skid, which can happen under heavy acceleration, for instance, and so diverts more torque to the front wheels for better stability.
^^Taken for wheels mag a few years ago from memory

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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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Kosti wrote:

I don't think it's 50/50 is more 45/55 big_smile
^^Taken for wheels mag a few years ago from memory
^^^^^Which would explain the front wheels spinning with the bigger turbo.

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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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fatcat67 wrote:

^^^^^Which would explain the front wheels spinning with the bigger turbo.
I'd expect 45/55 to be 45 front and 55 rear though :Dntknw:

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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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Hmmm I thought the AWD on Subarus were full time 50/50? So whats the split on a B4?

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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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MY02B4 wrote:

Hmmm I thought the AWD on Subarus were full time 50/50? So whats the split on a B4?
Manual is 50/50. Consensus seems to be auto is 95/5.

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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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I'll tell you now, that they all can move about in the range 50/50 to like 90/10.

My B4 will do both in the wet. If i boot it hard in 1st turning as i take off, it will spin the fronts big time..... to the point of rasing revs to redline. But if im moving a bit faster as im into it, it will do the best 4 wheel drifts across lanes!!! Or if im a bit violent (sometimes i like it!!!) i have actually got the B4 to go totally sideways across lanes bouncing off the limiter in 1st to the point where it will actually come back sideways the other way!!! heeheee

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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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Is there anyway to change the auto so that is has a more permanent 50/50 arrangement?

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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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B42.2 wrote:

...lots of awful driving descriptions...
Where do you drive normally? Just so that I know where to avoid :blush2:

XoN
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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Hey guys,

check this site out for the official write up on symmectrical AWD.

http://www.subaru-global.com/about/awd/index.html

doesnt seem to say about the 90/10 debate though.

cahmon
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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Here you go lads, something I found online:

"We often refer to the All-Wheel Drive (AWD) capabilities of a Subaru, but don't specifically mention the type of AWD system used. Because of this, many Subaru owners assume that the same All-Wheel Drive system is used in all Subaru models. In fact, two different types of Subaru AWD systems are available across the model line. The system type is dependent upon which transmission the vehicle has, manual or automatic. Although the two transmission and All -Wheel Drive types are different, both systems automatically distribute power to all four wheels as needed to maintain traction. For example, if the front wheels start to slip, power is instantly directed to the rear wheels, and if the rear wheels start to slip, power is instantly directed to the front wheels. When a vehicle is braking or accelerating, it causes the weight to shift, thereby reducing traction. Subaru AWD transfers power from the wheels that slip to the wheels that grip.

"3"

In vehicles with the 5-speed manual transmission, the All-Wheel Drive uses a viscous coupling in a center differential inside the transaxle case. It contains a series of opposing discs attached to the front and rear output shafts, surrounded by a silicone fluid. In normal operation, power is distributed equally between the front and rear wheels (50/50 power split). Loss of traction at either the front or rear wheels causes a rotational difference between the front and rear discs in the viscous unit, which then shears the silicone fluid.

The shearing action heats the fluid, causing it to thicken. As the fluid thickens, the discs lock together to transfer power from the slipping wheels to the wheels with the best traction. When traction is regained, all the discs turn at the same speed, restoring the 50/50 power split. The process is quick and unnoticeable to the driver and passengers.

The 5-speed All-Wheel Drive system is simple, compact and virtually invisible in operation. Its traction adds a significant margin of safety on all road surfaces.

"3"

Subaru vehicles equipped with the 4-speed Electronic Automatic Transmission (4EAT) feature a different type of All-Wheel Drive than with the 5-speed manual transmission. Instead of a viscous coupling center differential, an automatic transmission-equipped Subaru features an electronically managed continuously variable multi-plate transfer clutch located in the transaxle's tailshaft. Power transfer is governed by slippage in the clutch plates, which use a special friction material that easily handles the loads generated during power transfer.

The Transmission Control Module (TCM) controls the All-Wheel Drive multi-plate clutch. Under normal driving conditions, the power split is biased toward the front wheels. The active All-Wheel Drive system can adjust the power split in an instant, depending on many input factors. If the front wheels begin to lose traction, the TCM increases hydraulic pressure on the clutch, reducing slippage of the plates to transfer power to the rear wheels. As the front wheels regain traction, the TCM reduces pressure on the clutch, increasing slippage of the plates and transferring power to the front. The TCM monitors inputs from speed sensors on the front and rear output shafts and from the throttle position and transmission shifter position sensors. These factors cause the TCM to select a software "map" that determines how aggressively the TCM adjusts the power split between the front and rear wheels.

Viscous Limited-Slip - Rear Differential

For even greater traction capability, select Subaru vehicles feature a viscous limited-slip rear differential. If one rear wheel starts to lose traction, the differential automatically transfers the power to the other wheel. A viscous limited-slip differential not only helps traction in very slippery on- and off-road conditions, but it's also a cornering aid. With some vehicles, tight cornering can cause the inside rear wheel to lift, which diminishes traction and can compromise safety. The viscous limited-slip differential automatically transfers power to the rear wheel with the best traction, providing improved cornering and superior stability."

WhiteRX
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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Cheers mate, thats an Awesome bit of info.

Should be sticky'd.

Soop
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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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^^^^

No worries mate - Google is our friend!

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Re: Symmetrical AWD

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Active Power Split AWD For 4-Speed Automatic Transmissions

Subaru vehicles equipped with the 4-speed Electronic Automatic Transmission (4EAT) feature a different type of All-Wheel Drive than with the 5-speed manual transmission. Instead of a viscous coupling center differential, an automatic transmission-equipped Subaru features an electronically managed continuously variable multi-plate transfer clutch located in the transaxle's tailshaft. Power transfer is governed by slippage in the clutch plates, which use a special friction material that easily handles the loads generated during power transfer.

The Transmission Control Module (TCM) controls the All-Wheel Drive multi-plate clutch. Under normal driving conditions, the power split is biased toward the front wheels. The active All-Wheel Drive system can adjust the power split in an instant, depending on many input factors. If the front wheels begin to lose traction, the TCM increases hydraulic pressure on the clutch, reducing slippage of the plates to transfer power to the rear wheels. As the front wheels regain traction, the TCM reduces pressure on the clutch, increasing slippage of the plates and transferring power to the front. The TCM monitors inputs from speed sensors on the front and rear output shafts and from the throttle position and transmission shifter position sensors. These factors cause the TCM to select a software "map" that determines how aggressively the TCM adjusts the power split between the front and rear wheels.
Is there any way to adjust this 'map' so that there is a more permanent 50/50 or 60/40 split??

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